The Oregon Crimefighting Act of 2008

[ilovecats]

Kevin Mannix, a well-connected Republican activist who has formerly run for Oregon Governor, has filed a petition for an initiative misleadingly called The Oregon Crimefighting Act of 2008.

The initiative, if it gains enough signatures to qualify for the ballot, "replaces the Medical Marijuana Act with a more medically appropriate Marijuana Derivative and Synthetic Cannabinoid Prescription Program to focus help on those with legitimate needs." :confused:

In other words, all medical marijuana patients currently protected under OMMA would no longer be able to grow or use herbal marijuana as of March 31, 2009, and would instead be forced to use synthetic THC pills like Marinol or Cesamet. Many patients find these pills to be ineffective or overeffective, with strong undesirable side effects. Additionally, the prescriptions for these medications are very expensive. :eek:

Mannix claims that these changes are necessary because of "abuse of the system currently in place" and has couched this language as just one section of an initiative that also provides tough language to fight meth, sex crimes, domestic violence, drunk drivers, and to tighten control over convicted criminals. We must work now to get this information to the people of Oregon so they are not fooled into repealing OMMA in the name of fighting crime. Tell everyone to Just Say No to the Mannix "Oregon Crimefighting Act" initiative. :mad:

[kz4bdz]

yeah and from the articles that I have read(Oregonian), there was no mention of the loss of the ommp,(so far)they are just pushing the anti-crime part of it and apparently hoping that the mmj part goes unnoticed. imo

[NlightND]

No question about it, MR. Mannix and others like him want to squash our right to grow our own medicine and keep enough "RAW" Herb for our needs.
We all know that the Pharma companys want to sell us our meds, Mannix is only feeding the machine that raised him, perhaps MR. Mannix could be better Educated on How "natural" herb is much more easily titrated to an individuals own needs without overmedicating. The use of different strains for fine tuning therapies for the many and various afflictions that MMJ helps should also be explained to him.

First and foremost, the State of Oregon makes money on the ommp, and the percentage of those growers who sell thier MMJ on the Black market are so low, "and they get caught" THAT MMJ AND THE OMMP SHOULD NEVER BE ALLOWED ON ANY BILL OF THIS NATURE UNLESS THEY CAN PROVE THAT THE OMMP INCREASES CRIME. !!!!

Ask any police officer you see, if they think the the OMMP is increasing crime. You might be very surprized at thier answer being in favor of the OMMP.
Make Mannix show PROOF.

[AlphaMale]

No question about it, MR. Mannix and others like him want to squash our right to grow our own medicine and keep enough "RAW" Herb for our needs.
We all know that the Pharma companys want to sell us our meds, Mannix is only feeding the machine that raised him, perhaps MR. Mannix could be better Educated on How "natural" herb is much more easily titrated to an individuals own needs without overmedicating. The use of different strains for fine tuning therapies for the many and various afflictions that MMJ helps should also be explained to him.

First and foremost, the State of Oregon makes money on the ommp, and the percentage of those growers who sell thier MMJ on the Black market are so low, "and they get caught" THAT MMJ AND THE OMMP SHOULD NEVER BE ALLOWED ON ANY BILL OF THIS NATURE UNLESS THEY CAN PROVE THAT THE OMMP INCREASES CRIME. !!!!

Ask any police officer you see, if they think the the OMMP is increasing crime. You might be very surprized at thier answer being in favor of the OMMP.
Make Mannix show PROOF.


You are right...this is nothing but groundless allegations of rampant crime that does not exist. Some of the local cops tried this to no avail. They contend mmj growers and patients are selling on the BM. Exaggerating any statistic they can dredge up. Truth is, there is a case pending, accusing a local grower of dealing. They have him on tape, so it will be interesting to see if his connections to certain political activists and high priced lawyers, plus a two year delay in getting to trial will result in the outcome he is hoping for. This sort of greed does not exemplify the patient/grower we want to project as the image of OMMP.

Mannix should have to back up his contention of crime in the OMMP with solid data. He cannot produce it. It doesn't exist. Instead of standing to win approval of a bill with some redeeming factors...he is gambling the entire thang on the mmj issue. He may not have been confronted w/ it in the Oregonian Article, but he ain't heard nothin' yet.

Many if not most of the local communities in Oregon got on the meth bandwagon a couple years ago..many of them have task forces already funded with federal money. Much of the anti meth work is already being done. Perhaps not enough, but do we really need to create another commission to combat the problem? And in a related story, when is First, Live and Local news going to start a "PotWatch"segment?

I think Mannix may have spit in his plate on this one.

best,
AM

[laughinglion]

Please turn on your printers and get out your pens, we have work to do.

The Oregon Crimefighting Act of 2008 violates the single subject rule. Lawyers could help me here but, my take it on it is that each item would have to be voted on seperately to be valid according to the Oregon State Constitution. Voters would be forced into approving or disapproving the whole ball of wax. This is not the intent of the law.

Again, according to the cover page on the initiative, The Secretary of State, Bill Bradbury, is seeking public input on whether proposed initiative petition (#104) satisfies the procedural requirements established in the Oregon Constitution for circulation as a proposed initiative petition.

Please, respectfully write the Secretary at the Elections Division at the State Capitol. They must be received by the Elections Division no later than July 9, 2007 in order to be considered for review.

When writing public officials, keep in mind that these comments will be part of the public record.

According to the State of Oregon (website), this is where to write:
Oregon Secretary of State Elections Division
141 State Capitol
Salem, OR. 97310

phone: 503.986-1518


Here is Bill Bradbury's address too:
Oregon Secretary of State
136 State Capitol
Salem, OR. 97310


IN BUD WE MEND.

[MrsRoadRunner]

Please turn on your printers and get out your pens, we have work to do.

The Oregon Crimefighting Act of 2008 violates the single subject rule. Lawyers could help me here but, my take it on it is that each item would have to be voted on seperately to be valid according to the Oregon State Constitution. Voters would be forced into approving or disapproving the whole ball of wax. This is not the intent of the law.

Again, according to the cover page on the initiative, The Secretary of State, Bill Bradbury, is seeking public input on whether proposed initiative petition (#104) satisfies the procedural requirements established in the Oregon Constitution for circulation as a proposed initiative petition.

Please, respectfully write the Secretary at the Elections Division at the State Capitol. They must be received by the Elections Division no later than July 9, 2007 in order to be considered for review.

When writing public officials, keep in mind that these comments will be part of the public record.

According to the State of Oregon (website), this is where to write:
Oregon Secretary of State Elections Division
141 State Capitol
Salem, OR. 97310

phone: 503.986-1518


Here is Bill Bradbury's address too:
Oregon Secretary of State
136 State Capitol
Salem, OR. 97310


IN BUD WE MEND.

This is what I wrote. I hand wrote this with my arthritic hands so I had to keep it short and hopefully sweet lol! I am told my handwriting is getting horrible. But I took time and it is legible. Anyhoo here is what I wrote,

Dear Secretary,
I am writing in regards to The Oregon Crimefighting Act of 2008.
I am a Medical marijuana patient who after years of being on different pharmaceutical medications with horrible side effect decided to go this route.
With my arthritic hands I am hand writing you to please reconsider this Oregon Crimefighting Act of 2008.
Please reject The Oregon Crimefighting Act of 2008!
Thank you,

Then my contact info.
Hopefully this is good enough? takes me forever to hand write something but I thought they would get more from it being hand written......

BTW; I for got to add this. From the Oregon NORML Web Site;
Kevin Mannix wants to repeal the Oregon Medical Marijuana Act!

Kevin Mannix, a well-connected Republican activist who has formerly run for Oregon Governor, has filed a petition for an initiative misleadingly called The Oregon Crimefighting Act of 2008 (http://www.sos.state.or.us/elections/irr/2008/104text.pdf).
The initiative, if it gains enough signatures to qualify for the ballot, "replaces the Medical Marijuana Act with a more medically appropriate Marijuana Derivative and Synthetic Cannabinoid Prescription Program to focus help on those with legitimate needs."
In other words, all medical marijuana patients currently protected under OMMA would no longer be able to grow or use herbal marijuana as of March 31, 2009, and would instead be forced to use synthetic THC pills like Marinol or Cesamet. Many patients find these pills to be ineffective or overeffective, with strong undesirable side effects. Additionally, the prescriptions for these medications are very expensive.
Mannix claims that these changes are necessary because of "abuse of the system currently in place" and has couched this language as just one section of an initiative that also provides tough language to fight meth, sex crimes, domestic violence, drunk drivers, and to tighten control over convicted criminals. We must work now to get this information to the people of Oregon so they are not fooled into repealing OMMA in the name of fighting crime. Tell everyone to Just Say No to the Mannix "Oregon Crimefighting Act" initiative.

[pebbles]

The Republicans would have every American either in jail or enslaved to the government being dictated when to wipe your As* ! :mad:

[laughinglion]

July 3, 2007

Bill Bradbury
Secretary of State
141 State Capitol
Salem, Oregon 97301-0722


(Also sent a copy to:
(Oregon Secretary of State Elections Division
(141 State Capitol
(Salem, Oregon 97301


Mr. Bradbury:

I urge you to reject petition #104, The Crime fighting Act of 2008, because it violates the single subject requirement in the Oregon Constitution., Art IV sec 1 (2) (d), which states, "a proposed
law or amendment to the constitution shall embrace one subject only and matters properly connected therewith." Voters would not be able to make distinct choices proposed by each and every act in the measure.

Therefore, petition #104 does not satisfy the procedural requirements established in the Oregon Constitution.

Consider what happened in Oregon in 1996 when measure 40 was on the ballot. The measure passed, but it was overturned by the Oregon Supreme Court in Armatto v Kitzhaber, 327 Or. 250, 959 P. 2 d 49 (1998) on the grounds that it contained more than one amendment to the constitution Ballot measure 40 has been set as a case precedent; cited as the base for overturning several voter approved initiatives.

Each separate item must be voted upon separately to be valid according to the Oregon State Constitution. Oregon voters would be forced into approving or disapproving the whole measure, inclusive of any and all acts. This initiative, as written is not the intent of the law nor is it the will of the people.

This is why the Crime fighting Act of 2008 does not fit the procedural requirements set forth by law.

Thankyou for your consideration.

Respectfully yours,
Ms. (laughinglion)

Portland, Oregon

Thankyou Anthony J. & Voter Power and to GrammyChronnic for your invaluable research!
__________________

[AlphaMale]

The Republicans would have every American either in jail or enslaved to the government being dictated when to wipe your As* ! :mad:


Pebbles...maybe you should stick to something you know something about instead of trying to weigh in on political issues my friend. Your statement is pretty far out, don't you think? Are you sure you believe such a radical contention. Aren't you exaggerating just a little bit?
c'mon man, don't drink the Kool Aide.

Excellent letter laughing lion. Great effort. Let's hope we can shoot KM and his power grab right out of the saddle. thank you for speaking out.

best,
AM

[Rags]

As the country with the most people per capita incarcerated in the world, most for drug crimes, pebbles is not to far off. I would disagree about the republicans (all politicians are just that...politicians).

[StoneyGirl]

Mannix had this LTE in today's Oregonian

*A new assault on crime*

The Oregon Crimefighting Act (Initiative Petition 104), referenced by
Allan Erickson in his July 23 letter to the editor, is not just about
medical marijuana.

The Oregon Crimefighting Act provides tax credits for donations to drug
rehabilitation programs, establishes methamphetamine strike forces,
toughens prison penalties for repeat sex offenders, imposes jail time
for repeat drunken drivers, authorizes use of retired police as
volunteers, and much more. It has 15 substantive provisions designed to
be our D-Day assault on crime in Oregon.

One section replaces the Medical Marijuana Act with a prescription
program for people with debilitating conditions that previously might
have qualified them for a medical marijuana card. This carefully crafted
program assures the provision of medication through a prescription
program but would no longer validate easy opportunities to grow and
distribute marijuana.

Mere possession of up to one ounce of marijuana remains as it is now: a
civil penalty.

We propose to replace the Medical Marijuana Act with this
taxpayer-supported prescription program for the truly ill because of the
abuse of the current law.

KEVIN L. MANNIX Salem

so, here's a pro-active thought.

Patients who have tried marinol, and it either didn't work, caused
horrific side effects (either because of being unable to titrate dosage,
or otherwise) or was far too expensive compared with cultivating medical
cannabis ought to write LTEs and copy Mannix. I think he would be
surprised to learn, for example, that a federal medical cannabis patient
(Elvy) lives in Oregon, and falls within this category of patients.

thanks,

Lee Berger, Portland

[NITEN1]

I am new and just starting to follow this part of the law. Are there statistics showing that the members of the OMMP has abused the system the way it is set up. Or is this like everything else they talk about bulls---.:mad:

[StoneyGirl]

Very few people abuse the system. For the most prt, those who can't follow the rules stay undergroundand illegal. That is just bullshit that the opposition throws around because they hate it that we grow pot.

[AlphaMale]

If there are stats to back up the contention of "abuse of the current law" they would have been compiled by local pd and OSP. If there are municipalities that are struggling under the burden of enforcing current OMMP regulations, we need to know that as citizens.
Why hasn't this come out in the media? The rampage of OMMP patients selling pot? If Mannix pulls the stats out of his hat...which he must do to prove his contentions of abuse...then his focus should go toward enforcement, rather than disbanding a program with relatively few incidents of severe abuse of the system.
Is he going to shut down the pharmacy at Freddys because of all the poor folks who are or have been victimized by addiction in the Oxycotin scheme? How about all those ne're do wells who sell their pain meds? Is he going to restrict everyone else from getting pills?
This initiative is a slap in the face of every law abiding cardholder in the OMMP. It is disgraceful. It implies that a vote against the bill is a vote against the public good. It groups innocent mmj patients with the felons who deal in meth and with sex abusers and drunk drivers.
This attack gives us the best reason in the world to teach and preach compliance along with how to grow and the other thangs we represent. We have to put the best foot forward in the face of the coming battle.

best,
AM

[NITEN1]

OK. That is well stated.

[HD Grower]

F*ck Manixx...:mad:
He & his cronies are in the Rx industrys pockets, as far as educating him one can not teach ,who is unwilling to learn...
It is just a political play for the right wing sheep!
The guantlet has ben thrown down & the threat is real.
What do you think would happen to the OMMP if Manixx was elected Gov?
Time to run this S.O.B out of office or better yet the state! lets send hime to Iowa Kansas or some other right wing state.

[StoneyGirl]

Mannix's contact information:

Kevin Mannix
2003 State Street, Salem OR 97301
Phone: (503) 364-1913 Fax: (503) 362-0513


Kevin's e-mail address is
kevin@mannixlawfirm.com.
Lets flood him with information.

Everybody tell him what!

[mountaindude]

quick message i just sent to mr mannix


Why would you want to gut the only state program that actually makes a profit and is self sustaining?
the oregon medical marijuana law is designed to help sick ,dying and people with chronic pain. these people only want to grow a few plants and use the flowers for medicine. Prescriptions such as marinol and others are made by pharmaceutical companies to make a profit. If you sent all 15,000 ommp card holders to the oregon health plan to get their prescriptions its puts a burden on the state and makes it so other drugs may become more expensice. It seems your only problem is that the current problem is abuse, but you show no facts that old sick people are growing hundreds of plants and becomming drug lords. If there was a problem the state police and other law agencys would step up and say so like they did with the meth problem. I think you have your hands in the pockets of drug companies since you cant prove the problem is real, and you dont come out and say let the state grow the plants and distribute the medicine at a profit for the state or at least self sustaining,.Your solution is to let drug companies make the profit??? by the way how many people each month Go to fred meyers ,get their legal prescriptions for pain and turn around and sell them for cash.. YOU know its way more than sell cannabis, but that would hurt drug companies profits and look bad for your friend rush limbaugh.
Overwhelming support was shown by the voters. And when we all gather with our canes and wheelchairs many who are veterans with our american flags THEN YOU MAY REALIZE YOUR PICKING ON THE SICK AND DYING WAS THE WRONG IDEA. Remember the average age of the people on the ommp is almost 60 years old!!!! let us grow our little plants and use the flowers its the right thing to do.
thank you

[laughinglion]

A letter from the compliance specialist (Carla Corbin) dated July 24th reads in portion:

"There now follows an appeal period of ten business days. Any elector dissatisfied with the ballot title certified by the Attorney General, who also submitted in a timely manner written comments which addressed the specific legal standards a ballot title must meet may petition the Supreme Court for a different title. The appeal period ends August 7 2007."


The caption of the ballot title has been modified. The amended title reads:
"replaces Marijuana Act" in place of "repeals Marijuana Act. This will appear even more inoculous. Voters might really be confused. Many voters many not even know what the "Marijuana Act" is. "Replacing" it, how; they might think anything from adding more or less plants to more or less police.With all the other get tough on crime measure thrown into the same ball of wax who is to know? I am almost sure that was the intent. Most likely, voters will think that they are voting on a bill to strenghten the cops and get tough on the crimanals; having no idea they are about to dismantle one of the most effective and model state medical marijuana programs.

I still truly believe that this measure does not follow the one subject rule.
I truly wish Leland Berger, esq., Anthony Johnson, esq., Madeline Martinez,
and few others who commented would help me prepare an answer to the Supreme Court and to the Elections Division. I have no background in law. But, I am a patient. And I'm mad as hell and we shouldn't have to take this anymore.

The letter ends with this final statement: "In addition, the Secretary of State is responsible for reviewing proposed initiative petitions for compliance with procedural constitutional requirements. By administrative rule, this review is conducted before the cover and signature sheets for a proposed initiative may be approved for circulation. Secretary of State Bradbury has examed the proposed initiative petition and determined that it complies with procedural constitutional requirements."

I politely beg to differ, Bill. That one subject rule. You've got five just in the title. Then well over a dozen in the body of the measure.

Lastly, Marinol, would not be suited for many medical conditions because might cause seizures and many other side effects. Thc in synthetic or pure form is not an appropriate medication for those with many disorders including multiple sclerosis, seizures and chronic pain. It is indicated for cancer patients or for those with appetite problems. But it is not intended for long term use. Therefore there is no pharmaceutical equivalent in the US phamacopea. Just read the label.


"THE APPEAL PROCEDURES ARE OUTLINED IN ORS 250.085"

[laughinglion]

The required number of signatures for placement on the 2008 general election ballot is 82,769, filed by July 3, 2008.

[laughinglion]

EVERYONE WHO ANSWERED THE FIRST TIME MUST RESPOND AGAIN by August 7th
Appeal Procedures are outlined in ORS 250.085

[laughinglion]

250.085 Procedure for elector dissatisfied with title of state measure; Supreme Court review of title. (1) Any elector dissatisfied with a ballot title prepared by the Legislative Assembly for a measure referred to the people by the assembly and filed with the Secretary of State may petition the Supreme Court seeking a different title. The petition shall state the reasons that the title filed with the Secretary of State does not substantially comply with the requirements of ORS 250.035.
(2) Any elector dissatisfied with a ballot title for an initiated or referred measure certified by the Attorney General and who timely submitted written comments on the draft ballot title may petition the Supreme Court seeking a different title. The petition shall state the reasons that the title filed with the Secretary of State does not substantially comply with the requirements of ORS 250.035.
(3) The petition shall name the Attorney General as the respondent and must be filed:
(a) Not later than the 10th business day after the Attorney General certifies a ballot title to the Secretary of State; or
(b) If the title is provided by the Legislative Assembly under ORS 250.075, not later than the 10th business day after the Legislative Assembly files the ballot title with the Secretary of State.
(4) An elector filing a petition under this section shall notify the Secretary of State in writing that the petition has been filed. The notice must be received in the office of the Secretary of State not later than 5 p.m. on the next business day following the day the petition is filed.
(5) The Supreme Court shall review the title for substantial compliance with the requirements of ORS 250.035.
(6) When reviewing a title prepared by the Attorney General, the Supreme Court shall not consider arguments concerning the ballot title not presented in writing to the Secretary of State unless the court determines that the argument concerns language added to or removed from the draft title after expiration of the comment period provided in ORS 250.067.
(7) The review by the Supreme Court shall be conducted expeditiously to ensure the orderly and timely circulation of the petition or conduct of the election at which the measure is to be submitted to the electors.
(8) If the Supreme Court determines that the title certified by the Attorney General or prepared by the Legislative Assembly substantially complies with the requirements of ORS 250.035, the court shall certify the title to the Secretary of State. If the Supreme Court determines that the title certified by the Attorney General or prepared by the Legislative Assembly does not substantially comply with the requirements of ORS 250.035, the court shall modify the ballot title and certify the ballot title to the Secretary of State or refer the ballot title to the Attorney General for modification.
(9) Not later than five business days after the Supreme Court refers a ballot title to the Attorney General under this section, the Attorney General shall file a modified ballot title with the Supreme Court and serve copies of the modified ballot title on all parties to the ballot title review proceeding. If no party to the ballot title review proceeding files an objection to the modified ballot title within five business days after the date the modified ballot title is filed, the Supreme Court shall certify the modified ballot title to the Secretary of State and enter an appellate judgment the next judicial day. If any of the parties to the ballot title review proceeding timely files a petition objecting to the modified ballot title, the Supreme Court shall review the modified ballot title to determine whether the modified ballot title substantially complies with the requirements of ORS 250.035.
(10) Upon the filing of a petition under subsection (9) of this section objecting to a modified ballot title:
(a) If the Supreme Court determines that the modified ballot title substantially complies with the requirements of ORS 250.035, the court shall certify the modified ballot title to the Secretary of State; or
(b) If the Supreme Court determines that the modified ballot title does not substantially comply with the requirements of ORS 250.035, the court shall modify the ballot title and certify the ballot title to the Secretary of State or refer the modified ballot title to the Attorney General for additional modification and further proceedings under subsection (9) of this section. [Formerly 254.077; 1983 c.514 §9; 1985 c.447 §6; 1987 c.519 §2; 1989 c.503 §6; 1993 c.493 §96; 1995 c.534 §2; 2001 c.802 §2]

[kellyjohndog]

That's all? well Shucks..

[laughinglion]

I was just told to reply to the Supreme Court
when I called CANNABIS COMMON SENSE.
Hey, I was told to make it in legalize form!!
(No wonder pleas are written on pleading paper.)

Anyone ESQ. or from Portland NORML want to help?
(I'll even gladly become a member!)
ME v. Kevin Mannix
arguments against measure
# regarding the word repeals for replace in Marijuana Act are not clear
# public payment for synthetic cannabinoids on so many levels
and violation of one subject rule does not meet requirements set forth by law

[rancher]

I think it is more important to focus communicating on the persuadable voters rather than on Mannix. The chance that we are going to enlighten him sufficiently to change his mind is very unlikely. He is do doubt more concerned about the support he gets from LE and get tough on crime conservatives than the truth.

Our best strategy for defeating Mannix:
Get the message out that the so-called "Oregon crimefighting Act" is actually the repeal of OMMA and an expensive boondoggle of taxpayers paying for Marinol. At this stage of the campaign LTEs are probably the best way to communicate with voters.

Voter Power is planning to do extensive grassroots outreach educating about the Mannix boondoggle at public events over the next year. Contact us if you want to help with tabling, leafleting etc.

Voter Power also plans to challenge both Bradbury's constituional ruling and the AG's certified ballot title. Both these challenges are complex technical legal challenges. You can't challenge a ballot title because you don't like it. You must challenge it because it fails to follow the law for ballot titles. Voter Power is consulting with a number of attorneys to bring these challenges. We hope to retain an attorney expert in these matters (even though we have our own attorneys). The ACLU is also apparently challenging these things.

Rather than all 20 people who filed comments filing separate lawsuits, I suggest people who want to help, work with us and help raise funds to hire the expert attorney.

John Sajo
Director, Voter Power

[Boulster]

Our best strategy for defeating Mannix:
Get the message out that the so-called "Oregon crimefighting Act" is actually the repeal of OMMA and an expensive boondoggle of taxpayers paying for Marinol. At this stage of the campaign LTEs are probably the best way to communicate with voters.

John Sajo
Director, Voter Power

Cost of Marinol to the voters:

1 pill @ $20.00 ====

1 patient : 365 pills (365 X $20.00) $7300.00 per year

13,000 Patients = $94,900,000.00

I wonder how many voter/taxpayers know that we would be putting almost 100 Mill directly into Pharm co. What a sales job!! Wonder if Manix gets a
commission?

[AlphaMale]

Isn't Marinol generally prescribed as appetite enhancement? IMO the efficacy attributed to Marinol, (which is slight) is a step backward from the sweet releaf we appreciate from mmj and the varied concoctions prepared from the raw herb.

My point is, the majority of patients are going to reject Marinol hands down as a part of their treatment. Heck, my dads' Dr. wouldn't even discuss it!

I would also be willing to wager most Drs. who recommend mmj would hesitate to prescribe Marinol or any synthetic cannabinoid. Especially for pain, since neither the derivative nor the synthetic have been indicated as an effective analgesic. The technology is still in the dark ages, thanx to the imposition of govt prohibition on true research.

The end result of Ini 104 would be as Mannix is proposing....no more sweet releaf and a return of many to the nightmares of opiate dependency and addiction. What a shame that would be after all these years of fighting for our rights to self medicate.

best,
AM

[sveng]

As the country with the most people per capita incarcerated in the world, most for drug crimes, pebbles is not to far off. I would disagree about the republicans (all politicians are just that...politicians).
hear hear!

[laughinglion]

Perhaps Drug Policy Alliance, Marijuana Policy Project and Oregon NORML
can help with a letter writing campaign. Meanwhile, effective LTE's sound like an excellent way to get the word out.

Anybody know how to reach these organizations - their lawyers - quickly?

[StoneyGirl]

Don't forget Americans for Safe Access! Does anybody know how to write a grant proposal?

[Madfingers]

Don't forget Americans for Safe Access! Does anybody know how to write a grant proposal?

We have written and submitted 2, there is much to them but not all that difficult especially when you have old ones to refer to as templates when doing the next.

Part of the problem with getting grants is who you submit them too and what they want in return . . . but I digress and this is the wrong forum to going into this.

Madfingers

[StoneyGirl]

ASA offers grants for special projects up to $25,000. They are all about safe access to mmj for patients. They are also afraid of "stepping on Madelin Martinez's toes". However, OR NORML has said that they will accept the results of a poll on dispensaries if it is handled by a third party ( like ASA). So I propose telling ASA that OR NORML has agreed to not oppose dispensaries if we run a poll on them, but they don't rust us to run it, so our question to ASA would be: Could ASA pay for and run a poll on initiative 111?

As far as what they might want in return, well we already do their work. Everything you currently do at an OGF meeting lives up to the responsibilities of an ASA affiliate.

[laughinglion]

Madeline Martinez of OR NORML called me personally Friday morning to let me know that the ACLU will be "taking care" of this problem with the Crimefighting Act of 2008.

Thankyou Madeline, and a big Thankyou to the ACLU!

[kali ma]

We shouldn't count on others to "take care" of this for us.
What does that mean anyway and how about some info rather than a placating "it's being handled".
I do not appreciate being treated like someone who doesn't need to know what those in the know know, i just don't need to worry and let them handle it for me. Please show us more respect than that Ms. Martinez.

We should all be working together to defeat Mr. Mannix and his plans for the OMMA.
It would be nice if folks would share their strategies so we could have idea of the big picture (rather than just some factions part) that is being presented.

Luckily, Lee and Voter Power are in communication with several lawyers, including the ACLU.
A rancher has already stated in an earlier post

"Rather than all 20 people who filed comments filing separate lawsuits, I suggest people who want to help, work with us and help raise funds to hire the expert attorney."

She costs 200 bucks an hour.
She is good at what she does.

We will also need to be out in the community educating folks about medical cannabis and why the current system is working for a lot of foks without costing the taxpayers any money. The Mannix ini is going to cost a bunch o money if it passes. Oregonians will love that.

We aren't even addressing the current number of sex offenders adequately (and that is being generous) .

We aren't taking care of the kids we have in state custody now due to child abuse.

Rural counties are closing libraries and law enforcement is as skinny as it can get and stiil be there at all.

Schools need money

where is the money for the meth task for going to come from?

A trade from the feds for repealing omma?

There is a nasty thought. How do we fight that one?

We need to be working together .

The threat is too real to pretend that it doesn't matter if we don't cooperate.

we need to get over it and work together.

Please. Everyone.

Do you see that this is more serious than likes, dislikes, approval, past slights, misunderstandings or mistakes?


Hope springs eternal,
kali ma

[laughinglion]

I wrote NORML legal about #104. This is their letter:

'Lau___:

We are aware of both the attempt by one legislator to repeal the medical marijuana law, and the attempt by Voter Power to expand the current medical use law (which, by the way, is being opposed by some of our allies in Oregon, because of the timing).

We will do what we can to oppose the repeal, but we will let the folks in Oregon sort out the merits or risks of the latest proposed initiative.

Regards,

Keith Stroup, Esq.
NORML Legal Counsel
keith@norml.org
www.norml.org' (http://www.norml.org')


It looks like national NORML is taking a rather safe stance. Seems a little unusual for an organization pushing for medical and legal mj for adults.

(Bold font added.)

[Boulster]

That does not sound good:-/

[laughinglion]

We shouldn't count on others to "take care" of this for us. I agree. I felt rather left in the dark when she said that. I feel so out of control about the whole deal. That is what IS so scary.
What does that mean anyway and how about some info rather than a placating "it's being handled".
I do not appreciate being treated like someone who doesn't need to know what those in the know know, i just don't need to worry and let them handle it for me. Please show us more respect than that Ms. Martinez.
Well said. It's not over until it's over. Number by number. Page by Page.
We should all be working together to defeat Mr. Mannix and his plans for the OMMA.
It would be nice if folks would share their strategies so we could have idea of the big picture (rather than just some factions part) that is being presented.
Like Bradbury says it follows ORS. On many levels we disagree.
Luckily, Lee and Voter Power are in communication with several lawyers, including the ACLU.
A rancher has already stated in an earlier post

"Rather than all 20 people who filed comments filing separate lawsuits, I suggest people who want to help, work with us and help raise funds to hire the expert attorney."

She costs 200 bucks an hour. I don't have 200 bucks (an hour). I am lucky if I have 20 bucks at the end of the month. I did my due diligence as a public citizen. I was one of only a couple handfuls that had the determination, motivation and haste that bothered to write the Electons Board. Many were lawyers. I am sure she knows her job. I have no doubt
She is good at what she does. I simply can't afford her expertise. If anyone wants to donate to VoterPower (in the name of us twenty-somethings that are really poor) that would be most appreciated. I already stated I would be more than happy to offer any assistance I could.
Sign affadavits or whatever. Sign me up. I'll get a ride. Spend the time necessary in the next remaining three days to get it done. I have been sending out emails for the last week- ever since I got the letter from the Secretary of State. I do believe in working together.

We will also need to be out in the community educating folks about medical cannabis and why the current system is working for a lot of foks without costing the taxpayers any money. The Mannix ini is going to cost a bunch o money if it passes. Oregonians will love that.

We aren't even addressing the current number of sex offenders adequately (and that is being generous) .

We aren't taking care of the kids we have in state custody now due to child abuse.

Rural counties are closing libraries and law enforcement is as skinny as it can get and stiil be there at all.

Schools need money

where is the money for the meth task for going to come from?

A trade from the feds for repealing omma?
There is a nasty thought. How do we fight that one?

We need to be working together . OMMA was making $$.

The threat is too real to pretend that it doesn't matter if we don't cooperate. The feds are fighting us tooth and nail.

we need to get over it and work together. I emailed NORML (local and national), VoterPower and MPP

Please. Everyone.

Do you see that this is more serious than likes, dislikes, approval, past slights, misunderstandings or mistakes? I agree


Hope springs eternal,
kali ma

Thankyou Kali Ma I'm not the enemy. No offence to Madeline either.
Just seems like as usual we are not mobilized. Don't want to get stomped on. Buy BM NO WAY. Don't ever want to go there. OMMP REDUCES THE BLACK MARKET/ "CRIME PROBLEM".

My hubbie and I are both ill. I am doing my best. I will continue to advovcate until I die.

[laughinglion]

We shouldn't count on others to "take care" of this for us. I agree. I felt rather left in the dark when she said that. I feel so out of control about the whole deal.

Maybe a paypal fund would help.

[laughinglion]

"Our best strategy for defeating Mannix:
Get the message out that the so-called "Oregon crimefighting Act" is actually the repeal of OMMA and an expensive boondoggle of taxpayers paying for Marinol. At this stage of the campaign LTEs are probably the best way to communicate with voters.

Voter Power is planning to do extensive grassroots outreach educating about the Mannix boondoggle at public events over the next year. Contact us if you want to help with tabling, leafleting etc.

Voter Power also plans to challenge both Bradbury's constituional ruling and the AG's certified ballot title. Both these challenges are complex technical legal challenges. You can't challenge a ballot title because you don't like it. You must challenge it because it fails to follow the law for ballot titles. Voter Power is consulting with a number of attorneys to bring these challenges. We hope to retain an attorney expert in these matters (even though we have our own attorneys). The ACLU is also apparently challenging these things.

Rather than all 20 people who filed comments filing separate lawsuits, I suggest people who want to help, work with us and help raise funds to hire the expert attorney.

John Sajo
Director, Voter Power"

Whatever it takes John. I sent letters via mail and mouse. I'm sick but I can put some more time in. We don't have the money to purchase slick PSA's so we are going to have to tell everyone we see about this and write LTE's as well. If Oregon falls it could be like dominoes, other states not far behind us. What a nightmare. I'd like to see us beat this before it gets to the ballot.

[Snakeoil]

A registered ,notarized letter from each patient in the program to the OMMP, the AG and the Governor of no confidence accompanied by a withdrawl from the program and prorated repayment of fee demand. Might get some attention not just from the state but the media( bringing to light the slow betrayal of the program). Followed by the reintroduction of the original OMMA on the ballot as originally written( making average Joe aware that even though he voted yes once it did not sink in to the ones supposed to SERVE US!)

[Sukiyaki]

In 2002 Kevin Mannix accepted $ 626,000 from the Pharmaceutical & Health

Products industry in his 2002 run for Governor of Oregon. Kevin is attached at

the hip with the pharmaceutical industry

[laughinglion]

"There ought to be a law."

[anthonyj]

The Oregonian

Sunday, August 5

What is he smoking?

Kevin Mannix has been smoking something strong if he thinks repealing the Oregon Medical Marijuana Act is part of fighting crime (Letters, July 26).

There are 17,000 patients registered in this program by more than 2,500 Oregon physicians. Participation in the program is growing because natural marijuana is superior for some patients to the alternative prescription drug choices.

Mannix's Initiative 104 falsely claims to "replace" marijuana with Marinol, a synthetic form of THC. But the 2,500 doctors who qualify patients for the marijuana program already could prescribe Marinol. They don't, because it doesn't work very well and is extremely expensive, sometimes more than $1,000 a month.

Mannix would force 17,000 patients to take a medicine they don't want and force taxpayers to pay for it. If there is any money left over for law enforcement after this boondoggle, police will have to spend it arresting and prosecuting the thousands of patients who won't quit taking a medicine that works. Voters should reject this misguided initiative.

JOHN SAJO Director, Voter Power Southeast Portland

http://www.oregonlive.com/letters/oregonia...ll=7&thispage=2 (http://www.oregonlive.com/letters/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/editorial/1186178122295470.xml&coll=7&thispage=2)

[anthonyj]

The Oregonian

Not fooled by Mannix plan

July 30, 2007


Politicians must love billion-dollar boondoggles because they can't help proposing them. Republican Kevin Mannix's plan to recriminalize medical marijuana and provide a taxpayer handout to the pharmaceutical industry could easily cost our state millions upon millions of dollars.

His so-called Oregon Crimefighting Act (Letters, July 26) would not reduce crime by making thousands of sick and disabled patients felons. Patients use medical marijuana to help them retain their sight despite their glaucoma and to help them survive through chemotherapy treatments.

Mannix wants to force hard-working Oregonians to shell out their money to the pharmaceutical industry for drugs that patients don't even want. Please don't be fooled by yet another Republican boondoggle. Don't support Initiative Petition 104.

ANTHONY JOHNSON
Political director, Voter Power
Southeast Portland

http://www.oregonlive.com/letters/or...500.xml&coll=7 (http://www.oregonlive.com/letters/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/editorial/118558591187500.xml&coll=7)

[grammychronic]

Gordon Smith gave "pfizer" an 11 BILLION "tax holiday" in 2002 ...WHAT did he get for Oregonians??? ZERO....
im guessin' he may know mannix.....

[Snakeoil]

This is what I sent to the Oregonian and Register Guard;

In response to Kevin Mannix and his "Oregon Crimefighting Act" I must at least give him honesty in advertizing. It is surely an act alright, acting as if repealing the will of the voters by deceptive wording is in the interest of sick and dying Oregonians. The repeal of the Oregon Medical Marijuana Act will not fight crime. It will only make criminals of 17,000 sick Oregonians making sensible and legal use of a simple herbal medicine.
We should ask ouselves if it is they we wish to "Crimefight"?

[kristi]

This is what I sent to the Oregonian and Register Guard;

In response to Kevin Mannix and his "Oregon Crimefighting Act" I must at least give him honesty in advertizing. It is surely an act alright, acting as if repealing the will of the voters by deceptive wording is in the interest of sick and dying Oregonians. The repeal of the Oregon Medical Marijuana Act will not fight crime. It will only make criminals of 17,000 sick Oregonians making sensible and legal use of a simple herbal medicine.
We should ask ouselves if it is they we wish to "Crimefight"?

very nice - precise and to the point

[tex53]

I couldn't agree more with the observation that Kevin Mannix is attempting to misle the public into choosing to eradicate the Oregon MMJ program.This divide and conquer tactic is a favorite and cheap way to confuse the real issue.And to attempt to dissuade this person from their course of action would be fruitless.However if we begin to follow the money trail of these politicians we can perhaps unveil hidden or surprise agendas.This is a goal we should seek.How?Use them against themselves.Lets say we have a grant writer who can get us money to organize and disseminate our ideology.We use these grant funds to trackpolitical agendas that are or may conflict with our agenda.OK I'm way out of my comfort zone here.There is an abstract concept in my head but whether it has merit or not I can't decide.I have time to offer a political agenda my services in whatever way deemed fit but I also have serious health issues that limit my involvement.I propose this:I am willing to go back to school or take grant writing courses to facillitate our importance in the MMJ political arena.We can use grants for so much especially with our 501 c status.Better yet I would like to see one of our younger,healthier,brighter members get the funds thru us to attend these classes with a certain amount of commitment time by them to us for paying for the classes.Or better yet some gracious soul that would care to become the OGF grant writer.Keeping in mind that they have a marketable skill so some form of compensation would be available.What if you had a 10,000 dollar grant to spend on statistical analysis of the Oregon political spectrum.The generalities in wordage are used by our enemies but we have power and more knowledge equates more power.Just a thought.Mike aka tex53

[kristi]

Update from our pal ....................
Tristan Reisfar
Host, Citizen Alert!
KPOV 106.7 LPFM
Bend Community Radio
kpov.org (http://kpov.org/)

From....... http://www.oregoncatalyst.com/index.php?/archives/820-
Kevin-Manix-Update-on-Seven-Petitions.html

Kevin Manix: Update on Seven Petitions
by Kevin Mannix Monday, September 10. 2007


Petition 40
We filed 149,000 signatures on Initiative Petition 40, which
establishes mandatory minimum sentences for drug dealing, identity
theft, burglary, auto theft, grand theft, and forgery in the first
degree. This is a statutory measure, and we need 82,000 verified
signatures to qualify for the ballot. We are certain this will be on
the ballot in November 2008 and will make a dramatic difference in
fighting drug dealing and other crimes in Oregon.

Petition 41
We have filed 163,000 signatures on Initiative Petition 41, which
dedicates 15% of lottery profits to public safety prevention,
investigation, and prosecution. This constitutional amendment
requires 110,000 verified signatures to get on the ballot, and we are
certain we will qualify it for November 2008. This amendment will
guarantee full funding to "CSI: Oregon," which consists of the
criminal investigation, forensics, and crime lab operations of the
Oregon State Police. One half of the funds from this amendment will
go to counties for prevention programs for very young children who
are at-risk, as well as for sheriff field operations and for
additional prosecutors.

Petition 54
Initiative Petition 54 is being circulated by volunteers. It is a
constitutional amendment which empowers communities to regulate strip
clubs. Because it is a volunteer effort, we will be working hard over
the next year to get enough signatures by June 2008, the petition
deadline.

Petition 51 and 53
I am also supporting Initiative Petitions 51 and 53, working with
Russ Walker and FreedomWorks. These petitions are presently in
circulation. They are statutory initiatives, which limit lawyer
contingent fees in civil cases (51) and penalize lawyers for
frivolous lawsuits (53). Signature gathering is proceeding at a fast
pace.

We have initiatives to reform laws relating to immigration at the
state level, but these are still tied up in ballot title contests in
the Supreme Court.

Petition 118 and 134
The Oregon Initiative Restoration Act which was Initiative Petition
118, has been withdrawn and replaced by a virtually identical
initiative still called the Oregon Initiative Restoration Act. This
is now Initiative Petition 134. This is designed to again make the
Oregon initiative and referendum process citizen-friendly and slash
away the political tangles which have been adopted by the political
elites to keep the people at bay.

Best regards,

Kevin
Kevin L. Mannix, p.c.
2009 state st.
salem, or 97301
503.364.1913 ofc.
503.362.0513 fax

[kristi]

as a sidenote - check out the TOS for posting on The Oregon Catalyst.... they do not seem very interested in contrary opinions - hahahahahaha check out who all posts there - c'mon, Bill Sizemore?

[elctrohze]

Having moved here from TX 2 years ago for a better quality of life,
I am appalled by the actions and intent of Mannix ... he and Smith
oughtta move to a red state instead of a blue one, let alone a green one!
Is there a petition going around that I could add my signature to?
It must be understood, however, that he, like all the rest, is just a NWO stooge pushing forward part of a global agenda for total enslavement of all mankind and he, also like the rest, must not succeed!

POWER TO THE PEACEFUL!:spaceman::spaceman::spaceman:

[rancher]

News Updates

Mannix files new version of Oregon Crimefighting Act

Kevin Mannix, along with Julia Allison and Wayne Brady, filed a newversion of his initiative to repeal OMMA on September 6. The new,simplified, version would impose mandatory minimum 25 year sentences forrepeat sex offenders, a 90 day minimum for repeat drunk drivers and wouldrepeal OMMA and replace it with taxpayer subsidized marinol. The repeal OMMA section is the same as in Proposed Initiative 104 with the addition of language that would allow the health department to require patients to get a second opinion from a DHS doctor before they would pay for a patient's Marinol.

The full text of this initiative can be found athttp://www.sos.state.or.us/elections/irr/2008/131text.pdf (http://www.sos.state.or.us/elections/irr/2008/131text.pdf)

Voter Power will challenge and oppose this initiative just as we have challenged Proposed Initiative 104. Anyone wishing to help with this effort please contact us at 503-224-3051.

Thanks

John Sajo
Director, Voter Power

[laughinglion]

State Medi-Pot Laws Not Associated With Increased Drug Use, Study Says
August 15, 2007 - College Station, TX, USA

College Station, TX: The enactment of state laws legalizing the medical use of cannabis is not associated with an increase in the drug’s recreational use, according to statistical data published in the International Journal of Drug Policy.
Investigators at the Texas A&M Health Science Center, Department of Epidemiology and Biostatistics, analyzed cannabis use trends among two high-risk subgroups (arrestees and emergency room patients) in five cities and five metropolitan areas in states that have enacted medical cannabis laws. In the four states (California (http://norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3391#California), Colorado (http://norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3391#Colorado), Oregon (http://norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3391#Oregon), and Washington (http://norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3391#Washington)) analyzed, researchers reported, "[T]he introduction of medical cannabis laws was not associated with an increase in cannabis use."
Previous studies (http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=3383) performed by the University of Michigan and others have also reported that liberalizing marijuana penalties is not associated with an increase in pot use.
Texas A&M investigators speculated that the passage of medical cannabis laws may "de-glamorize" the drug’s use and "thereby [does] little to encourage [its] use among other" non-medical patients.

From: NORML

Sure doesn't sound like what Mannix has been saying.

[NO2WAR]

News Updates

Mannix files new version of Oregon Crimefighting Act

Kevin Mannix, along with Julia Allison and Wayne Brady, filed a newversion of his initiative to repeal OMMA on September 6. The new,simplified, version would impose mandatory minimum 25 year sentences forrepeat sex offenders, a 90 day minimum for repeat drunk drivers and wouldrepeal OMMA and replace it with taxpayer subsidized marinol. The repeal OMMA section is the same as in Proposed Initiative 104 with the addition of language that would allow the health department to require patients to get a second opinion from a DHS doctor before they would pay for a patient's Marinol.

The full text of this initiative can be found athttp://www.sos.state.or.us/elections/irr/2008/131text.pdf (http://www.sos.state.or.us/elections/irr/2008/131text.pdf)

Voter Power will challenge and oppose this initiative just as we have challenged Proposed Initiative 104. Anyone wishing to help with this effort please contact us at 503-224-3051.

Thanks

John Sajo
Director, Voter Power
Has he already collected the signitures? or has he just filed to begin the collection process?

[rancher]

Has he already collected the signitures? or has he just filed to begin the collection process?

He has merely filed. That takes 25 good signatures. Now there is ten days for the Attorney General to draft a ballot title. The ballot title is the simple explanation of what the measure would do. It actually appears on the ballot and in the voters pamphlet that everyone receives so the exact language here is critical. Any voter can comment on the ballot title drafted by the AG. Then the AG revises the title accordingly. After that anyone who has commented can challenge the final certified ballot title to the OR Supreme Court. That is where we are with I104. Voter Power, the ACLU, and Mannix himself have filed challenges.

Mannix' revised version of the "Oregon Crimefighting Act" must go through the whole process. When the AG presents his draft ballot title, we will comment and likely challenge to the Court. The process can take up to about four months so Mannix probably won't be able to start petitioning until early 2008. 82,000 valid signatures are needed for a measure to appear on the ballot.

We need to assume that Mannix will be able to collect the signatures and plan for an aggressive campaign to alert voters who support medical marijuana that the "Oregon Crimefighting Act" will repeal OMMA.

Voter Power is actively organizing to oppose this Mannix initiative. If you want to help please contact us.

John Sajo
Director, Voter Power

[laughinglion]

September 10, 2007 - Monday

http://x.myspace.com/images/spacer.gif2 articles: We quashed the federal subpoena for patient records
Current mood: http://x.myspace.com/images/blog/moods/iBrads/happy.gif happy
Category: News and Politics (http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.viewCategory&FriendID=126620067&BlogCategoryID=17)

this:

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/news/118904732993670.xml&coll=7 (http://www.oregonlive.com/news/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/news/118904732993670.xml&coll=7)

Ruling protects pot patients

Privacy - A federal judge denies a grand jury access to Oregon medical marijuana treatment records

Thursday, September 06, 2007
ANNE SAKER
The Oregonian Staff

and

http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/09/us_court_rebukes_deas_attempt_to_crack_m (http://slog.thestranger.com/2007/09/us_court_rebukes_deas_attempt_to_crack_m)


Read it all above.


YIPPPIE!!

[laughinglion]

This is my favorite part (from the second link):


'But in a formal rebuke yesterday afternoon, a federal Judge sided with the state and the clinic, granting a motion to quash both subpoenas. “Absent a further showing of necessity and relevance, compliance with the subpoena would impact significant State and medical privacy interests and is unreasonable,” wrote Judge Robert H. Whaley of the U.S. Court Eastern District of Washington. The ruling represents a major defeat for the DEA and a victory for states with dissenting drug policies.'

[bornblonde]

This is a Very Good Idea. I am not a grant writer but sure think this would be a good way to go.Hope someone out there reading your post will dive right in.:-)

[bornblonde]

Sorry, the good idea i was refering to was Tex53's Grant writer need post.
Cool grant writers needed
I couldn't agree more with the observation that Kevin Mannix is attempting to misle the public into choosing to eradicate the Oregon MMJ program.This divide and conquer tactic is a favorite and cheap way to confuse the real issue.And to attempt to dissuade this person from their course of action would be fruitless.However if we begin to follow the money trail of these politicians we can perhaps unveil hidden or surprise agendas.This is a goal we should seek.How?Use them against themselves.Lets say we have a grant writer who can get us money to organize and disseminate our ideology.We use these grant funds to trackpolitical agendas that are or may conflict with our agenda.OK I'm way out of my comfort zone here.There is an abstract concept in my head but whether it has merit or not I can't decide.I have time to offer a political agenda my services in whatever way deemed fit but I also have serious health issues that limit my involvement.I propose this:I am willing to go back to school or take grant writing courses to facillitate our importance in the MMJ political arena.We can use grants for so much especially with our 501 c status.Better yet I would like to see one of our younger,healthier,brighter members get the funds thru us to attend these classes with a certain amount of commitment time by them to us for paying for the classes.Or better yet some gracious soul that would care to become the OGF grant writer.Keeping in mind that they have a marketable skill so some form of compensation would be available.What if you had a 10,000 dollar grant to spend on statistical analysis of the Oregon political spectrum.The generalities in wordage are used by our enemies but we have power and more knowledge equates more power.Just a thought.Mike aka tex53

[Go Long Dave]

Cost of Marinol to the voters:

1 pill @ $20.00 ====

1 patient : 365 pills (365 X $20.00) $7300.00 per year

13,000 Patients = $94,900,000.00

I wonder how many voter/taxpayers know that we would be putting almost 100 Mill directly into Pharm co. What a sales job!! Wonder if Manix gets a
commission?


i got news for you, it was $20 per pill, but i was expected to take 3 of them 4 times a day 12 X $20 X 365 = $87,600, so if we use an adjusted # since the dosage would be different for others, call it 3 pills a day, that still triples your estimate

[StoneyGirl]

When I took Marinol, it was 3 pills per day.

[Nero]

The Republicans would have every American either in jail or enslaved to the government being dictated when to wipe your As* ! :mad:

Pebbles, I would not paint with such a wide brush. Just like every Republican is NOT a bible thumping conservative, every Democrat is not a tree hugging pot smoking liberal.

[Infiniti]

Pebbles, I would not paint with such a wide brush. Just like every Republican is NOT a bible thumping conservative, every Democrat is not a tree hugging pot smoking liberal.
yea, look at Schwarzenegger. he's a Republican and he's actually decent. he goes with the will of his people.

[Theon]

I was on Marinol for several years and was taking four pills per day, usually every 5-6 hours. It was very expensive. Also Marinol is very difficult to titrate, and some people are allergic to the sesame seed oil in the pill. Sometimes it would not work, sometimes it would take hours to kick in, sometimes it would knock me out. Every dosage was really different. Whole MMJ is much better that THC alone. Also, there is an article in the Journal of Cannabis Therapeutics were whole cannabis was deemed better than Marinol or THC alone. I do not have access to that article right now, but it would be nice to locate it for reference and possible use in this attack on the OMMP.

Theon:cool:

When I took Marinol, it was 3 pills per day.

[scoobysnax]

It appears, then, that in the United States two powerful forces are colliding over the issue of medicinal cannabis. On the one hand, there is a growing interest in and acceptance of the medicinal importance of cannabis, and there is every reason to believe that this development will continue to gain momentum. As it does so it increasingly confronts the proscription against any use of marijuana. At the same time, there does not appear to be widespread interest in moving from an absolute prohibition against cannabis to a regulatory system which would allow for the responsible use of this drug. The federal government, until recently has denied any medical utility to cannabis, and it appears to be vehemently opposed to any relaxation of the prohibition.

There is little doubt that pharmaceutical companies will develop some cannabinoid products which will be at least as useful as marijuana, and some will be uniquely so. Also, some may be expected to be free or nearly so of psychoactivity; this will allow them to be placed outside of the constraints of the Comprehensive Drug Abuse Act classification, or at most assignment to Categories IV or V. They will require prescription and they will be expensive, but there will be a market. What is uncertain, and of course critical to a decision to develop new cannabinoid products, is the anticipated size of the market. The "pharmaceuticalization" of marijuana will only succeed if the pharmaceutical products displace marijuana as a medicine. This seems unlikely in view of the latter's limited toxicity, easy availability, low cost relative to pharmaceuticals, ease with which it can be self-titrated, growing access to vaporization devices, and its remarkable medical versatility. And if the legal costs of using marijuana are presently not so high that most people choose marijuana over dronabinol, it is difficult to imagine a level of enforcement which would eliminate use of the plant material.

It seems inevitable that at least for some period of time there will coexist two distribution pathways for this medicine: first, the conventional model of modern allopathic medicine through pharmacy-filled prescriptions for FDA-approved medicines; and second, a model closer to the distribution of alternative and herbal medicines, where there is little if any quality or quantity control. Either way, growing numbers of people will become familiar with cannabis and its derivative products. They will learn that its harmfulness has been greatly exaggerated and its usefulness underestimated. We can expect that with this growing sophistication about cannabis, there is likely to be growing pressure to change the way we as a society deal with people who use this drug for any reason.

Commentary:
On the Pharmaceuticalization of Marijuana
by
Lester Grinspoon, MD
Harvard University

[hugh_middity]

mr mannix needs to take his misinformation and hype and move to Arizona where (most of) his ilk reside.

[MarkMan]

Can't the initiative be defeated in court because it addresses two different issues, which is forbidden?
One issue is elimination of the OMMP program, the other issue is manditory sentences for property crimes.
Not permitted?

[GreenGoblin]

Can't the initiative be defeated in court because it addresses two different issues, which is forbidden?
One issue is elimination of the OMMP program, the other issue is manditory sentences for property crimes.
Not permitted?

I see VoterPower has a challenge filed, citing that and other issues. Here's the link:

http://voterpower.org/news/local/under_attack.php